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Re: Here is the news

Reply #3405
Remind me again who are the snowflakes and who is in favour of freedom of speech?

I hate this argument.. that comes up every time someone on *our side* says something and someone on *their side* says 'you can't say that'.

Firstly.. some people on *their side* are defenders of free speech who will condemn the police for getting involved here and condemn as 'snowflakes' anyone offended by the joke. That some have chosen to take offence does not invalidate free speech arguments form others. This is a common, and very bad, take.

Naturally, also, lots of people on *our side* who think Jo Brand sound be able to say what she said without triggering an outrage also think that people on *their side* are free to make similar jokes.

There are also people who just pick whatever argument they can with *their side*. These people are obvious idiots and can be ignored.

The real problems, and the people who keep us in the gutter, are the ones who would defend free speech but then, the minute something like this happens, take arguments they don't actually agree with (i.e. that saying what Jo Brand said needs to be prosecuted) and, nonethless, weaponize them against their opponents. There's a lot of that. It's basically "yeah well you started it". And, again, both sides are riven with it.

Russ is obviously wrong about Fake Twikky and the airport thing. But he's consistent. Jonathan Pie was all over defending the Nazi Pug bloke, and is defending Jo Brand.. because he's consistent. Graham Linehan was all over defending Fake Twikky, and will almost certainly be defending Jo Brand, but he wanted Nazi Pug Guy locked up because Nazi jokes are always not ok except when an entire episode of Fr Ted is a Nazi Joke.

So the fact that some folk who are assumed to be in the political camp that is assumed to be the one that defends free speech have made a fuss about Jo Brand does not, in any way whatsoever, invalidate the arguments of anyone else in that political camp who actually does defend free speech and actually doesn't think Jo Brand has done anything wrong.

The fact that free speech gets painted as a left-right issue is really sad. Can't we separate the very real issues that are at stake from the demands of soon-to-be-dead gammons to be allowed to be offensive? They really aren't very important, and certainly don't represent the arguments of people getting concerned about the increasingly dramatic consequences that can come from *saying things*.

I'm prepared to bet that not one single person on this board has not written, on this board, things that others have had met with police involvement or problems with employers or other such consequences... should any of us decide to run for high office or find ourselves as CEO of a bank, the talkback archives would be a goldmine of things that could be taken in or out of context and presented as 'problematic'. Can people spend a bit more time considering that sort of thing and a bet less time saying "wahey, someone I don't like just said something I can pretend to be outraged about".
this is an excellent rectangle

Re: Here is the news

Reply #3406
It doesn't help that I despise Twitter with a burning passion, I think it's an absolutely heinous medium that is the rotting heart of everything that's wrong with society and tools like Chambers are entirely representative of the sort of sh!thead that infests it.

Amen, brother. We have found a way of transforming the pub bore from amusing oddity into hailed influential visionary. All pretty dangerous really.

I'm prepared to bet that not one single person on this board has not written, on this board, things that others have had met with police involvement or problems with employers or other such consequences... should any of us decide to run for high office or find ourselves as CEO of a bank, the talkback archives would be a goldmine of things that could be taken in or out of context and presented as 'problematic'.

No idea what you are on about.
The hardest thing of all is to find a black cat in a dark room, especially if there is no cat.


 

Re: Here is the news

Reply #3409
The drumbeat towards war grows ever louder.

I completely  disagree with Corbyn when it comes to Russia; Putin is clearly a menace and cannot be appeased. But, he is right on the Iran issue. This growing drumbeat is a naked attempt by parties within the Trunp-c*nt constellation to further their own war agenda and finally topple the Iranian government. The point is not about who did what to whichever oil tanker, rather it is about why they are doing it. The US provokes Iran, which then retaliates, allowing the US to impose further provocations and so on. You get the picture. It's all so depressingly familiar...

Re: Here is the news

Reply #3410
Stupid of Corbyn to say what he did in the way he said it. Playing straight into the hands of those who want to portray him and Labour as unpatriotic communists who want to destroy our wonderful way of life.

Re: Here is the news

Reply #3411
Stupid of Corbyn to say what he did in the way he said it. Playing straight into the hands of those who want to portray him and Labour as unpatriotic communists who want to destroy our wonderful way of life.

If you oppose nationalism and warmongering what are you suppose to say?

Re: Here is the news

Reply #3412
Also the press is going to abuse Corbyn, and labour whatever they say because obviously they don't want any kind of decent government/society .

Re: Here is the news

Reply #3413
Grandpa picks strange bedfellows though. He's often supportive of Iran but he'd be the first person to disappear if he lived under that regime. They're not wild about unions or collectivism in the repressive authoritarian Islamic Republic.

But....wait...they are sworn enemies of Israel. Pure coincidence I'm sure.

A cynic might say that he's no better than most other politicians, in that his principles mean f*ck all depending on the particular context.

But I'm not that cynic, obvs.

Re: Here is the news

Reply #3414
Grandpa picks strange bedfellows though. He's often supportive of Iran but he'd be the first person to disappear if he lived under that regime. They're not wild about unions or collectivism in the repressive authoritarian Islamic Republic.

But....wait...they are sworn enemies of Israel. Pure coincidence I'm sure.

A cynic might say that he's no better than most other politicians, in that his principles mean f*ck all depending on the particular context.

But I'm not that cynic, obvs.

I don't think Corbyn's personal views on Iran or the Israel/Palestine conflict are relevent here. The objective surely must be to avoid getting sucked into another reckless war, or have we learned nothing from the Iraq War?

Re: Here is the news

Reply #3415
But surely if Iran did do it then they should be held to account.

That's a different question to whether the sanctions should be eased.

Re: Here is the news

Reply #3416
But surely if Iran did do it then they should be held to account.

That's a different question to whether the sanctions should be eased.

It's a cycle of violence that was precipitated by the US. We know Pompeo wants regime change in Iran, and elements within the US have never forgotten the humiliation of the 1979 revolution. I'm not saying that Iran is anything approaching a good neighbour to other countries, but let's not pretend that this is anything other than a deliberate US attempt to provoke conflict.

Re: Here is the news

Reply #3417
And the drum beats louder.

What happens next? The US pushes the UN to impose restrictions on Iranian movements and then does its best to ensure that Iran breaches them. But, in a Trump world, he may just not give a f*ck about the UN and decide to do whatever he likes. One fatal flaw in the much celebrated US 'checks and balances' system is that the President is free to do much as he likes with respect to foreign policy. There is little that Congress or the Senate can do to stop him going to war with Iran, even if they wanted to.

It's important not to be blinded by distaste for Corbyn here: the very real possibility of a war with Iran, given the current c*nts in circulation in the US, would be a catastrophically destabilising event in a region hardly noted for stability.

Brexit is important, yes. But, some things override even that and I will do everything I possibly can to try and prevent this country becoming embroiled in a war in Iran. I have huge respect for those who went on marches opposing Brexit and I would have joined were it not for family commitments, but if it came down to us getting close to war I would cancel any obligations I had to join a march.

The beat goes on, and it's worth watching closely.

Re: Here is the news

Reply #3418
Oooops.


https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/technology/2019/jun/17/flights-delayed-as-drones-fly-near-east-midlands-airport-download-festival


You would figure they would be a bit more sensitive considering they just had the 30th anniversary of the Kegworth air crash but apparently not.


Chicago: Heavy metal.
If running is bad for your knees try hanging out with Russ and Tricky for a night.

Re: Here is the news

Reply #3419
I'm pretty sure that the Kegworth air crash was nothing to do with drones.
They don't think it be like it is, but it do